John Kerry is running as a war hero?? Well did you know....

**thegman** · August 6th, 2004, 12:23 PM

Perhaps the real issue is why Kerry is running on something that happened thirty-plus years ago, and not on his record as a Senator?

It leads one to be believe that there is a recognition on Kerry's part that his record as a Senator is, perhaps, "out of touch" with mainstream America.

**gae** · August 6th, 2004, 02:05 PM

**Lew** · August 6th, 2004, 02:08 PM

Of course, as usual, it's flip-flop city from both parties. Back in 1992, military service meant nothing to the Democrats, and everything to the Republicans.

12 years later, it means everything to the Democrats, but not so much to the Republicans.

As you all know, I fully respect anyone who has served (Pina as well as Jumper on this board, if I am forgetting any others forgive me). But quite honestly, you can talk Swift boats, PT Boats, the Air National Guard, Seals, Rangers, et al. quite honestly, unless you're a JAG, you ain't crap.....

**reason** · August 6th, 2004, 04:00 PM

Originally posted by the-G-man:
Perhaps the real issue is why Kerry is running on something that happened thirty-plus years ago, and not on his record as a Senator?

It leads one to be believe that there is a recognition on Kerry's part that his record as a Senator is, perhaps, "out of touch" with mainstream America.

Because the Republicans want to portray themselves as the party able to defend us; when in fact their candidate went AWOL.

4 months of John Kerry in Vietnam is infinitely more impressive than years of George W at home snorting coke.

[ August 06, 2004 05:38 PM: Message edited by: reason ]

**Piña** · August 6th, 2004, 06:57 PM

Originally posted by Lew:
As you all know, I fully respect anyone who has served (Pina as well as Jumper on this board, if I am forgetting any others forgive me). But quite honestly, you can talk Swift boats, PT Boats, the Air National Guard, Seals, Rangers, et al. quite honestly, unless you're a JAG, you ain't crap.....

JAG!?

Those wusses?

The only thing I remember about them is that they didn't seem to do much of anything when we were underway and you couldn't find them when we were in port. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[ August 06, 2004 04:01 PM: Message edited by: Pi?a ]

**Piña** · August 6th, 2004, 07:14 PM

[ August 06, 2004 04:16 PM: Message edited by: Pi?a ]

**Piña** · August 6th, 2004, 08:23 PM

Veteran Backs Off Attack on Kerry?s War Record
Fri Aug 6, 2004 01:33 PM ET

BOSTON (Reuters) - John Kerry's commanding officer in Vietnam has backed away from attacks on the Democratic presidential candidate, saying he made a mistake in accusing the U.S. senator of having lied about his wartime record.

George Elliott, who was one of Kerry's superiors in Vietnam when he was awarded medals for heroic actions, had signed an affidavit suggesting Kerry did not deserve the Silver Star.

In the document, Elliott said, "I was never informed that he had simply shot a wounded, fleeing Viet Cong in the back."

But in Friday's Boston Globe, Elliott said: "It was a terrible mistake probably for me to sign the affidavit with those words. I'm the one in trouble here."

Elliott told the newspaper he thinks Kerry did deserve the medal.

"I still don't think he (Kerry) shot the guy in the back," Elliott is quoted as saying in the Globe.

Kerry used his nominating convention in Boston in July to paint himself as a decorated war hero capable of leading the nation in troubled times and a man better qualified to be commander-in-chief than President Bush.

But Elliott and other members of a group called Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, oppose Kerry.

This week they launched a television advertisement accusing the Democrat of having lied about his service in Vietnam and hurting other veterans by criticizing the war after returning home. Next week the group will publish a book, "Unfit for Command: Swift Boat Veterans Speak Out Against John Kerry."

Elliott was not immediately available for comment.

Kerry, arguing his combat experience in Vietnam qualifies him as a strong leader on national security issues, has surrounded himself with other veterans who have said the candidate did heroic deeds to save his own crew mates.

The new attacks on Kerry sparked an angry response from Republican Sen. John McCain, also a Vietnam veteran, who called the attack dishonorable and dishonest and urged the Bush administration to also denounce the ad.

The administration distanced itself from the advertisement on Thursday but did not condemn it.

"We have not and we will not question Sen. Kerry's service in Vietnam," said White House spokesman Scott McClellan.

Source

**Piña** · August 6th, 2004, 08:29 PM

From the Swiftvets Forum pages
I thought this was particularly well said and I agree with it 100%

ArogantMan
Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 1
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 7:42 pm Post subject: SwiftVets Thanks Alot 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I am a US Marine who served in Vietnam with 3/1 during 1969-1970. My older brothers Franklin (1968 -1970), and Stewart (1967) also served with the US Marines in Northern I Corps in Vietnam and all as grunts. My youngest son David is currently completing BCT at Ft. Benning Georgia, whereupon he will then attend OCS.

I have seen your advertisement on television, and I have to ask you this. What kind of outfit where you guys running down there in the Delta? Your statements and your deeds today certainly do not reflect a cohesive combat unit with high morale. I assume that your commanding officer must be responsible for a lot of this. Is it possible that he also appears in this advertisement? Does he agree with all that you are doing, denigrating a member of your unit for political purposes? Is it not true that your Commanding Officer, would had to have endorsed Lt. (JG) Kerry's recommendations for his Bronze Star Medals and Silver Star Medal.

I understand that Lt. Cmdr. Elliot has since retracted all his statements about Lt. (JG) Kerry's character while he served with him in Vietnam. In deed, it was Lt. Cmdr. Elliot's own recommendation that earned LT. (JG) Kerry's Silver Star Medal. How do you guys reconcile that?

You speak of Lt. (JG) Kerry as if he was a liar when he spoke to the Congressional Committee in 1972. That he was solely responsible for painting the Vietnam Veteran and his shipmates in a bad light. Are you trying to suggest that there where no atrocities committed by our troops in Vietnam? No "Free Fire Zones", No "County Fair" operations that resulted in burnt out villages and dead livestock? No deaths of civilians and prisoners?

You fail to mention however that Kerry and his group the "Vietnam Veterans Against the War" (VVAW) totaled over 30,000 combat veterans in 1972 and that VVAW was instrumental in getting the US Government to acknowledge the problems associated with many of us. Problems associated with Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome, and Agent Orange and that because of those efforts many veterans today are receiving health and financial benefits from our government.

You conveniently fail to mention that it was John Kerry and John McCain that went to Vietnam to work with the government in Vietnam to find answers to those heroes that were "Missing in Action". That as a result of their efforts many of their remains where brought back to their families where they belong, and in so doing help return our relationship with Vietnam to one where we earned their cooperation.

John O?Neil, what a piece of work that guy is. He gets his 15 minutes of fame by debating John Kerry on the Merv Griffith Show back in 1972. He did this on behalf of one of the most corrupt administrations in US History. An administration whose leader President Nixon became the only U.S. President to leave office in disgrace. Now I see that horse's ass is still out there trying to extend his 15 minutes of fame to thirty minutes by doing the same thing on behalf of an administration whose ethics are being question by at least half the electorate. An administration whose members for the most part did their best to avoid even going to Vietnam. I find this shameful.

I believe what you are doing is unprecedented in the history of U. S. Presidential Campaigns. I do not believe any US Veteran has ever allowed politics to transcend his service, or the respect he had for his brother's service. They may have disagreed with a candidate, they may not have like him when they served with him, but no one has ever stooped as low as you all have.

I served honorably in Vietnam, and have felt my service was important and that the legacy of all of our service was not to necessarily stop the spread of communism, but to insure that senseless wars where never fought again. I thought it was our duty to insure that we would never send our youth off to distant shores to spill their blood, over a war that was not necessary. Look where we are now.

And here you guys are. You allowed mere politics to transcend our honor, and our legacy. You denigrate to the world another Vietnam Veteran. A veteran you served with no less. You bring shame and disgrace on your unit, your commanding officer, the US Navy, and all the other Veterans who served in Vietnam many of whom do not agree with you. You are the ones that sold us all out, not John Kerry. You are the real traitors.

Barry DeLong, USMC
RVN 1969-70

http://www.swiftvets.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1670

**thegman** · August 7th, 2004, 02:22 AM

Originally posted by reason:
the Republicans want to portray themselves as the party able to defend us...4 months of John Kerry in Vietnam is infinitely more impressive

If actual experience in the military was intended to be a prerequiste for the office of President, why didn't the framers of the US Constitution require the President be a general?

Answer: they wanted the military led by a civilian as a check and balance on Presidential power/militarism.

**thegman** · August 7th, 2004, 02:22 AM

Originally posted by Pi?a:
[QB]Veteran Backs Off Attack on Kerry?s War Record
Fri Aug 6, 2004 01:33 PM ET

BOSTON (Reuters) - John Kerry's commanding officer in Vietnam has backed away from attacks on the Democratic presidential candidate, saying he made a mistake in accusing the U.S. senator of having lied about his wartime record.

Elliot is saying that this article misquotes him and that he is sticking by the ad.